Oct. 16, 2025

Transitions & Messy Middles

Transitions & Messy Middles
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Join Dr. Lewis in a conversation with Kelly Dwyer. Kelly is an executive coach, facilitator, and podcast host who helps leaders and teams unlock their full potential. She brings a unique blend of business insight and emotional intelligence to her work, guiding executives, founders, and nonprofit leaders through growth, change, and the messy middle. Kelly also hosts the podcast, Life from Within. Email: kd@kellydwyer.co. Website: https://www.kellydwyer.co

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WEBVTT

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The topics and opinions expressed on the following show are

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solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not

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those of W four WN Radio It's employees or affiliates.

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We make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,

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be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing

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W four WN Radios.

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Success Successful Women, Hard suns Rise Successful Women.

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Did you know women represent just three percent of Fortune

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five hundred CEOs and less than fifteen percent of corporate

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executives at top companies worldwide? Have you wondered what the

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secrets are to getting into the top ranks, whether in

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the private or public sector. Do you want to figure

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out how to stop being held back in your career?

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Are passed over for promotion, then you're in the right place.

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Hi.

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I'm doctor Matlanane lewis President and CEO of the Executive

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Women's Success Institute. I have decades of experience in the military,

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the federal government, and corporate America and My mission is

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to help women succeed and tap into their full potential.

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I want to reach a million plus women around the

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world to become the leaders they are meant to be.

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So if you want to move into a management or

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executive level position, or maybe you are a female veteran

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transitioning out of the military into business entrepreneurship, then reach

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out to the Executive Women's Success Institute at three zero

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one six nine three three two eight four let us

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get you on the fast track to success. Well. Hello, Hello,

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hello everyone, and welcome to the Success for Women's Show,

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where you can view us on Talk for TV and

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listen to us on the Women for Women Network. I

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am doctor Madeline Ann Lewis your host, and my mission

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is to help women accelerate the path to success. Well.

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Today's topic is Transitions and Messy Middles and my guest

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is Mss Kelly Dwyer. Let me just give you a

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little background on Kelly. Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach

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for facilitator and podcast hosts who helps leaders and teams

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unlock their full potential. She brings a unique blend of

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business insight and emotional intelligence to her work, guiding executives, founders,

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and nonprofit leaders through growth, change, and the Messy Middle.

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Kelly also hosts Life from Within, a podcast about transforming

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how we live and lead from the inside out. I

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am so excited to bring to the show today, Ms

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Kelly Dwyer.

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Hello, Doctor Lewis, Thank you for having me today. Oh,

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it's a.

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Great pleasure to have you here. We can't wait to

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have you share some of your nuggets with us. But

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before we get started, I always give the standard bio

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on my guests, but then I like to ask the question,

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just what do you want us to know about Kelly Dwyer?

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Tell us what you want us to know?

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What do I want you to know? I want you

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all to know that we're all in this together. We

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are all in process, we are all working with what's emerging,

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and we all have our conditioning and patterns that we're

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trying to transform. And so one of the reasons why

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I love the work that I get to do that

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you probably feel the same way or feel similarly, is

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that I get to learn as my clients learn, and

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I get to use the wisdom and insight that I'm

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gaining from my own experiences and my own transformation in

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life and help my clients with that.

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So wow, And you know that brings me to my

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next question as to what first drew you into coaching

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and facilitation. What made you get into that arena.

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That's a good question. So I've been coaching and facilitating

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in some form or fashion for almost twenty years. It's

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only been full time for the last seven or eight.

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And first, way back when I got into coaching because

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I wanted to find work that felt meaningful for me,

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and I actually was a participant in a coaching program

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about how to find your purpose, and so I went

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through that program as a participant and then started to

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be mentored by the founder of the creator of that program,

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and then started coaching people through that program. So that

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was my foray into coaching, and it's evolved over the

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years into what it is now. And then as far

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as facilitation, I've also been facilitating groups, but the facilitation

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didn't really come into clear vision until I was working

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for this software company. I was working for an agile

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project management software company called Rally Software, and I was

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helping them expand internationally managing various strategic projects. And there

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was a project that I was working on where I

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facilitated a cross functional group of leaders through the research

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and decision making process about where to locate our European headquarters.

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And I loved it. I loved the work. I loved

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helping the group make the decision together in a way

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that felt harmonious.

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Wow, that is very interesting. You know, we all have

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our different reasons for why we get into the areas

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we get into. But you know, when you're into coaching

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and facilitating, it takes a certain something that will draw

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you to that particular field. It really does, you know,

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because for one, it's going to bring you in contact

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with the lot of people a lot of times dealing

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sometimes with their personal, you know, lives. And so that's why,

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you know, I asked that question, because you just never

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know how you're going to affect someone when you're in

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that in that area and you have to talk to

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them about, you know, different things, different personal problems, even

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even if it's just their career or even business or

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what have you. A lot of times it still gets

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into the personal part of it.

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Absolutely, And I firmly believe that none of us escapes

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childhood unscathed, and we don't leave our conditioning and patterns

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at home. When we go to work, we bring them

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with us.

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You know, it's always there. What did they what's that saying?

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Is that we live life?

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Uh?

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Is it we live life forward? But it's it's the

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past that we always have with us. I can't remember

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it goes now, but I do know it's always the

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past that even though it's the past, it's still always there.

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And some people can't break away from that that past,

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which is some it can tend to be unfortunate. But

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you know, so that's why sometimes you need coaches, you

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need therapists, you need you need the whole team. Oh yes,

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absolutely So can you share a time that you helped

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a leader move through a messy middle?

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Yes? I'd love to. Okay, So this example or is

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a client who I worked with, and she was a

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newer executive and the team, the executive team was relatively small.

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They were on a four or five people right. Some

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executive teams can get up to seven, eight people and beyond.

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But that's a really big executive team.

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Uh.

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And the CEO was also pretty new. She was a

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first time CEO. I think she'd been in the role

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about a year. And so my client was we we

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were and she and my client was initiating a new

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function within the organization. So she was building a team,

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and she had gotten some feedback that she had some

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sharp elbows and so and so we you know, we

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worked together. We worked through what does that mean? What what?

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Why are people? Why do people have that perception? What

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is she doing or not doing? What might she want

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to experiment experiment with changing around at least that piece

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of feedback. But there was also many of the clients

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I work with are so smart and which makes it

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really fun, and they're fast pros sessors. They think really fast.

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And so she had also gotten some feedback that she

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needed to bring people along, and that's a common piece

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of feedback for really smart senior leaders. They moved so fast.

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And stay two women probably I think both.

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I've had the experience of both. But okay, okay, And

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so we were working on those things. And on top

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of that, she was about to go out on maternity leave,

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and so we were she was developing her plan for

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how to get this new function to be successful and

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be able to function while she was out on maternity leave.

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So we worked together prior to maternity leave, and then

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we continued our work after she came back from maternity leave,

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and by that and then when she came back, there

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were some dynamics had shifted on the executive team, so

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that was something new for her to deal with. Plus

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now she had two young kids that she was at home,

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and she had a very supportive husband, but he was

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also working and there's a lot to manage.

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Uh.

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So when when I say working with an individual, that's

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an example of helping someone through the messy middle of newness,

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a new a new, new ish role, some hard feedback, uh,

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dealing with a new a boss who's new in their

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new ish in their role, dealing with some certainty in

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the peer relationships. So that's an example of a messy middle.

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And then there are lots of people I've worked with

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in career transition right or job transition, and that is

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a very definite in between. I usually use the word

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in between, but it does feel easy at times.

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Yeah, it absolutely is. To be honest with you, I've

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dealt well, especially looking at the female veterans when they're

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transitioning out of the military, because because a lot of

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times it's that mindset too, that that strict, you know,

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mindset that they have when they're coming out of the military,

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that it's like, Okay, you, when you're running a company

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or you want to start your own business or what

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have you, you can't really treat them like they're your soldiers.

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You know that the soldiers under you. You have to

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kind of we got to pivot that a little bit.

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But yeah, yeah, different cultures, right, Absolutely, the environment and

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the culture and the way people are and people our

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personalities are all different, and so we respond to different

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styles of leadership.

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Absolutely. When you said about the sharp elbow, I was like, Oh,

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that's that's the new one, and I'd never heard that

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torm but I get it.

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Yeah. Yeah. I was just talking earlier this week with

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someone who had an experience with at a company where

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she actually ended up leaving because the people around her

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were pulling out their sharp elbows and she she wasn't

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ready at the time or willing at the time to

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go to the mat right so to speak.

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Wow yeah, wow, So do you have a story or

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can you give us the story of a team that

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shifted once they learned to honor the differences, Like we

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talk about the different cultures and different things like that,

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Do you have an example of that that where a

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team the whole team just shifted because they learned to

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honor the differences.

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Yeah, there was a financial tech company that I was

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working with and this was an extended leadership team. And

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so that means that it was both the executive team

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plus the next layer of leadership. So a dozen people

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ish and the team. Are you familiar with Bruce Tuckman's

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stages team stages of development, the forming, storming, norming, and performing.

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So they were in classics storming. They they came together

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and you know, in the storming for for this team

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and commonly for teams, when they're storming, it could.

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Look like.

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Individuals on the team having conflicts so openly butting heads

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with one another. It can look like certain individuals disengaging,

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just quietly disengaging, sitting back, just letting it, letting it

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all play out, without putting their voice into the mix.

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It could it could look like creating factions. So there

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were some factions that were starting to form, you know,

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many groups of people within the team that were starting

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to h oppose one another in a more formalized way.

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So storming a lot of storming. And what we did

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is now when you're working with a team, You're working

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with all of these different personalities. You're working at a

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lot of different levels. I mean, when we're working with individuals,

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we're working at different levels too, We're working at the

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level of the identity and values and that whatnot. But

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when we're talking about a team, first of all, they

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need to have shared understanding of what it is there.

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What's the purpose of the team? Right, what is the

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purpose of their team? And what is the team trying

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to achieve together? Now I can't hear you. I don't

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know what happened to your audio?

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You don't hear me? Okay, you're not hearing me.

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You were nodding though, so I think you could hear me. Yes,

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I can hear you. Okay, So yeah, I'm going to

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keep going. You work on your audio. So so the team,

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they have to have a shared understanding of what it is.

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What's the purpose of the team. Why are they a

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team in the first place? What is it that they

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are meant to achieve together or trying to achieve together?

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So some shared understanding. And then once you have the

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shared understanding, it's also important for the team to understand

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who's in the room, what are the personality tendencies that

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are present in the conversations you know, is someone? Are

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are a few? Who are who are the few people

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that are super dominant in the conversation, who are always

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going to be the first to put their opinion into

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the mix. Who are the folks that are super detail oriented?

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Who are the people who just want the big picture

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and don't bother me with the details. So understanding personality

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is important. So shared understanding of where you're going, the vision,

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the purpose of the team, and the shared goal. And

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then an understanding of the personalities that are on the

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team and how that might show up in communication, how

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it impacts collaboration, how that might impact the ways that

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we are in that we have conflict with one another.

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Okay, And then.

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There was another thing that we did together, and we

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built some team working agreements. And I think this is

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this is great. This can be done even with a

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leader and one of their direct reports to build a

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set of working agreements. But with this team, we built

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some working agreements. And that means, how are we going

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to communicate? How are we going to engage in conflict

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when I disagree with you? We are we in agreement

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that we're going to be upfront and not be polite,

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I mean, not be rude, but not be so polite

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that we don't say what we need to say. Okay,

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So some team working agreements, and then I would say

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what was the other thing that we did? Now? I

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think those are the big three things that really helped

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that team move from storming into a place of norming.

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So they had the team agreements, they had the shared

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purpose and shared goal, and they understood who was in

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the room. They understood better who their teammates are, which

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allows them to take fewer things personally. So when someone

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is doing their thing, it's not because they're doing it

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to me. It's because that's how they show up with everyone,

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and so it becomes less of a why is this

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person treating me this way? Right? M hm hm? Okay,

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are we back with your audio?

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Can you hear me now?

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No? I cannot hear you. Let me see if there's.

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How about changed the set? How about now? No?

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Check my speaker settings? Okay, I'm checking them. Okay, talk now, Okay,

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how's that?

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Still? Can't hear me? Still not here? H I'm not

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sure what that is.

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Okay, let me try it different. Let me try something else.

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Okay, you're talking now, yeah, can you hear me? Hear you?

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I don't know what's happening.

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Yeah, because we're both fine. The engineer can hear it,

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can hear us both? I'm not sure if you can

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hear that.

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But okay, I'm unplugging my headphones now everyone headphones. Headphones

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are unplugged, and I'm just gonna move to I'm move

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to my lap laptop, microphone and laptop speakers.

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Okay, how's that sign? Okay, we like can you hear

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me now? I'm so sad ah and we can both

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hear you. I'm plugging your hip. Yeah you did that.

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How do difficulties here? Keep the right right microphone? Only

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change the speaker setting, yeah, microphone. I changed the speaker

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setting to my MacBook Pro speakers. I'll go to default

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now talk.

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Okay, how about now? And still can't hear me?

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Hm hm? I am at a loss? Okay, refreshing the page.

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Okay, so does that mean okay she has to come out? Okay,

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okay to my viewers and listeners out there, sorry for

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the technical difficulty, but we are going to get this

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straight so that we can continue. I can hear you.

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Now there her nuggets with us. Okay, she's back and

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STI can hear me, I can hear you. All right,

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we are back in action here. So the next question

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I have for you was, why do you think so

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many leaders feel stuck in the messy middle and how

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can they move through it? Oh?

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Boy, I feel like this is everyone today in some regards.

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In some regards, Uh, well, I don't know about you,

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but the leaders I work with, they have their plates

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are so full to overflowing, it's incredible. And you have

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multiple stakeholder groups that you're trying to satisfy. So it

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could be let's say you're in classically middle level managers

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are the most crunched with this, right, So they've got

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they've got the executives demanding certain things of them, They've

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got their direct reports who are have their own demands

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and needs. You've got the clients or your customers who

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you want to satisfy as well, and so it's just

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there's so much on the plate.

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And so.

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I think that and less a leader is disciplined about

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taking time for strategic thinking, then they are going to

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be consistently stuck in the messy middle. Overwhelmed and just

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completely reactive to what's happening around them. And that's one

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of the things I think coaching really brings is dedicated

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strategic thinking time. And that's how I position myself to

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clients when I'm potential clients, when I'm talking with them,

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I say, I really see myself as your strategic thought partner,

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right a place where a client a dedicated space and

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time they can come and they can hear their words

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reflected back. I mean, how many times have you had

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a client say to you. They'll say something and then

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you reflect back what you heard them say, and they'll say, oh,

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that's such a great idea. It's your idea, right yeah.

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So uh so I think that this taking time for

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strategic thinking is thing one, and then the second thing

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is and none of this is rocket science.

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We hear this.

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I think it's just it's much easier said than done.

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The second thing is to really stay super focused on

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the few things that matter most.

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Wow, right, absolutely, I mean, because you know, as you said,

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it's it's always gonna be, You're gonna have that messy

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middle no matter what. Like you said, you got that

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messy middle. And the thing of it is to figure

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out how to really get out of it sort of speak,

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and that's what that's the whole point of you know,

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and and and again it's almost like the sharp elbows.

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It's interesting that you call it that, you know, the

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messy middle, and that's really what struck my curiosity when

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I was reading about you and I saw that about

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the messy middle. I'm like, Okay, I really need to

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know what this is all about, you know, because the

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way you explain it, it's like I never thought about

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it like that. But it is a messy middle.

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Yeah, I mean, so we're you know, there are times

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where we are really clear about what it is we

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want and we are on our path to making that happen,

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and we know what the steps are that we need

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to take. And then there are other times where we're,

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I don't know, we fall into this pit of overthinking

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or being emotionally activated and not be able to get

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ourselves out of that. So on a personal level, that's

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kind of the messy middle for groups, though for teams,

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when I refer to the messy middle, it's actually a

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very specific thing when when a group is let's say

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a group is trying to answer a question together or

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make a decision together. There is a predictable process, okay,

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or a predictable trajectory journey that the group is going

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to go on. And that means so as long as

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they're the question they're trying to answer, the problem they're

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trying to solve is clearly articulated, they can start to

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have conversations and brainstorm and and put out ideas and

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suggestions for how they want to answer this question or

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solve this problem. And what will happen is they'll get Yeah,

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So what happens is the ideas start to diverge, so

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you start to get lots of wild and crazy ideas,

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and then you get into this area that's called another

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it's also called the groan zone. Who initiated that, Sam Kiner?

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Sam Kiner, there's a great book for all of you

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people who want to be better facilitators of groups. It's

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called The Facilitator's Guide to Participatory Decision Making. Great book,

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and you'll see the groan zone in there. And the

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groan zone is when you've the group has been discussing

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this question or problem for a while, and you've gotten

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lots of different, very divergent ideas and opinions out on

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the table, and now the groups starts to get impatient

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because they want the answer to be clear, but the

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answer is not yet clear, right, and so you start

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to get bad behavior here. This is the why is

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that person keep saying the same thing over and over again?

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And this isn't this process isn't working? Or what are

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we going to be done with this? Right? So all

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of the impatience and the bad behaviors start to show up.

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But if you if you persevere through, like in the conversation,

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and you have a facilitated process. So if you have

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a process, you're actually following to get to the decision.

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So you don't want just open discussion because that can

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go that can be too expansive. It doesn't have a container.

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So as long as you have a facilitative process and

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you persevere through the conversation, eventually what's going to happen

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is the group will converge. Now it might not be

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unanimous consensus, but the group will converge to a degree

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of consensus around what the right next step is, or

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what the answer to the question is, or what the

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solution to the problem is. And so that groan zone

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is the messy middle for in terms of the group dynamic.

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Right, okay, wow, So how do you help leaders build

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clarity and confidence in high stake situations?

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I love this well, Claire. First of all, to get

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to clarity, you have to ask the question what do

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you want?

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What do you want?

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That needs to be clear? And then I think it's

425
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also really important to consider the contextual factors, the people

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who are also a part of this situation, the circumstances themselves.

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Is there, what's the timeline associated with these circumstances, What

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other important factors need to be discussed and thought about

429
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in relationship to what you want? So, in other words,

430
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of all these things in your situation, what's going to

431
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stand in the way of getting you what? What's going

432
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to stand as an obstacle to getting what you want?

433
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What could aid you in getting what you want? So

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you start with what you want, you think about, you

435
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kind of examine context that you're in, and then you

436
00:29:06.720 --> 00:29:10.440
you could experiment or like figure out what's the next

437
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:14.119
right step. So maybe you don't know the full answer yet,

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but you the client is able to discern the next

439
00:29:20.119 --> 00:29:24.160
right step or the next right conversation. They need to

440
00:29:24.279 --> 00:29:29.319
have to get more information, okay, so that they can

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then figure out discern what their next step is going

442
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:36.559
to be. Yeah, So that's the clarity piece, and then

443
00:29:36.640 --> 00:29:42.319
the confidence piece really comes from trusting that. So if

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you discern, hey, I think this is my next right

445
00:29:45.880 --> 00:29:50.000
step or next right conversation, and even if that feels scary,

446
00:29:50.240 --> 00:29:54.519
but taking the action on that, you will feel more

447
00:29:54.680 --> 00:30:01.119
confident after you take the action. Okay, So the confidence

448
00:30:01.279 --> 00:30:08.400
builds over time as someone takes small actions toward an

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00:30:08.480 --> 00:30:11.640
ultimate resolution. Did that answer your question?

450
00:30:12.160 --> 00:30:17.720
Yes it did, it did. But tell me in all

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of this, what are some practical tools leaders can use

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to bring out the best say in the teams in

453
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their teams.

454
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Well, I mentioned a couple of them. Well I mentioned

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personality understanding the personality tendencies. There's a tool, there's a

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specific platform I use called clover Leaf, and clover Leaf

457
00:30:41.039 --> 00:30:46.960
is a wonderful tool where you can have basically you

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take multiple different personality assessments and all of the results

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are displayed on one dashboard for you. They're displayed on

460
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one dashboard for the individual, and then also there's a

461
00:30:57.599 --> 00:31:01.680
team dashboard that shows the results for all of the

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00:31:01.759 --> 00:31:07.160
team members. So there's the visual, synthesized results. And then

463
00:31:07.359 --> 00:31:10.599
what clever Leaf has done is they have they basically

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the platform has AI driven coaching tips that you can use.

465
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You can query the platform as a leader or as

466
00:31:21.640 --> 00:31:25.559
an individual, Hey how can I work better with this person?

467
00:31:26.319 --> 00:31:28.839
And the platform will say, well, given that this person

468
00:31:29.759 --> 00:31:31.599
likes a lot of structure and they like a lot

469
00:31:31.680 --> 00:31:34.279
of detail, when you're going to approach them and pitch

470
00:31:34.400 --> 00:31:37.160
them on an idea, you're going to want to make

471
00:31:37.240 --> 00:31:40.359
sure you're giving them enough detail, or you're going to

472
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:43.000
want to tell them right up front, hey, here's what

473
00:31:43.119 --> 00:31:46.400
I'm looking, Here's what I want from you. Here's I

474
00:31:46.519 --> 00:31:48.680
want to have this conversation, and first I want to

475
00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:50.200
talk about this. Then I want to talk about this,

476
00:31:50.279 --> 00:31:52.680
and I want to talk about this. Sound good? Yeah,

477
00:31:52.799 --> 00:31:56.599
sounds good. So now you've given the person an outline

478
00:31:56.759 --> 00:31:58.880
for the conversation, so that gives them a level of

479
00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:02.960
detail that helps them feel safe to say, yeah, okay,

480
00:32:03.319 --> 00:32:07.319
I'm here, I'm ready, I'm listening, let's go okay. So

481
00:32:07.480 --> 00:32:10.079
that's one thing. So the clover Leaf platform that helps

482
00:32:10.160 --> 00:32:16.079
with the personality stuff. Okay, and then you know, with

483
00:32:16.279 --> 00:32:20.119
the team agreements. I think that anytime you're working with

484
00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:22.920
a group or a team, which is a group of people,

485
00:32:23.039 --> 00:32:29.279
but a team, a team is a group of individuals

486
00:32:29.359 --> 00:32:31.279
that has a shared goal. If they don't have a

487
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:34.400
shared goal, they're just a group of individuals, right, So

488
00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:39.720
a team when you're working with a team, any time

489
00:32:39.799 --> 00:32:44.000
you want to build shared understanding with the team, there

490
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:48.319
needs to be a process of brainstorming. Now it could

491
00:32:48.359 --> 00:32:51.839
look different. It doesn't have to be whole group brainstorming

492
00:32:51.960 --> 00:32:54.839
right away, but there needs to be brainstorming. There needs

493
00:32:54.880 --> 00:32:59.119
to be synthesis as a group, and then there needs

494
00:32:59.200 --> 00:33:03.279
to be sort of the group coming to some degree

495
00:33:04.000 --> 00:33:08.960
of consensus around whatever it is, the set of team agreements,

496
00:33:09.400 --> 00:33:14.079
the decision to move forward, et cetera. And there's probably

497
00:33:14.200 --> 00:33:16.240
more here, but I felt like I talked a lot there.

498
00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:17.319
Did that answer your question?

499
00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:26.720
What challenges do you see executives and leaders facing most

500
00:33:26.839 --> 00:33:28.359
that they face most today?

501
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:32.759
You've probably heard a lot of people say this, but

502
00:33:33.000 --> 00:33:42.400
I and I know that the acronym VUKA the volatile, uncertain, complex,

503
00:33:43.079 --> 00:33:48.880
ambiguous environment that we're in today, right, I mean like

504
00:33:49.720 --> 00:33:57.640
leading leading through that is challenging. And so I again,

505
00:33:57.920 --> 00:34:01.279
I think it comes back to being clear about what

506
00:34:01.480 --> 00:34:05.440
you want as a team, as a company, as a person,

507
00:34:08.639 --> 00:34:14.920
being able to manage yourself and attend to your relationships

508
00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:20.280
the inner personal dynamics in the midst of that complexity

509
00:34:20.679 --> 00:34:24.400
and the pressure and the stress of the uncertainty and

510
00:34:24.519 --> 00:34:28.400
the ambiguity. So not losing sight of that, you know.

511
00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:31.440
There you might have heard of this. In the nineteen seventies.

512
00:34:31.480 --> 00:34:36.039
There was a study done with seminary students and they

513
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:40.199
were told so the experiment that was done was they

514
00:34:40.280 --> 00:34:42.239
broke them into two groups and they were told, okay,

515
00:34:43.199 --> 00:34:45.159
you students are each of you is going to have

516
00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:47.440
to give a lecture on the Good Samaritan. So that's

517
00:34:47.559 --> 00:34:54.039
like helping strangers, right, and they put then they so

518
00:34:54.199 --> 00:34:56.800
one of the groups they said, and okay, so you

519
00:34:56.920 --> 00:34:59.000
need to give a sermon on the Good Samaritan, and

520
00:34:59.440 --> 00:35:01.920
you have a few minutes. You can take your time

521
00:35:02.039 --> 00:35:04.599
getting over to the room, and then you're going to

522
00:35:04.639 --> 00:35:09.840
do it. Another group they said, oh, oh, actually you're late,

523
00:35:10.400 --> 00:35:12.280
so you need to get right over to the room

524
00:35:12.440 --> 00:35:15.440
to give your sermon. And so what they found and

525
00:35:15.519 --> 00:35:19.360
then they placed a person in a doorway in the

526
00:35:19.559 --> 00:35:23.360
path from one building to the next that was groaning

527
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:28.360
and in obvious distress. And what they found is the

528
00:35:28.519 --> 00:35:35.440
group of people that was under time pressure just overlook them. Yes,

529
00:35:36.199 --> 00:35:39.079
by and large, the majority of them just passed by

530
00:35:39.239 --> 00:35:42.400
this stranger, which is so ironic because here they were

531
00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:45.519
about to go give a sermon on the good sperriton. Right.

532
00:35:46.800 --> 00:35:47.039
Yeah.

533
00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:54.519
So bringing this back to the reality of the VUKA situation,

534
00:35:55.159 --> 00:36:02.199
the environment that we're all living through this pressure, being

535
00:36:02.280 --> 00:36:09.159
aware of the fact that the pressure impacts our willingness

536
00:36:09.320 --> 00:36:14.920
to show compassion for ourselves for other people. And so

537
00:36:16.360 --> 00:36:20.039
I think it's important for us to be intentional about

538
00:36:21.400 --> 00:36:25.079
slowing down, even for a little bit. Yeah, so that

539
00:36:25.199 --> 00:36:26.480
we can be more intentional.

540
00:36:27.559 --> 00:36:33.320
Absolutely, we move forward, absolutely. Yeah. And it also kind

541
00:36:33.360 --> 00:36:36.719
of gives you a little clarity too, so that you

542
00:36:36.880 --> 00:36:41.119
can move forward when you slow down and just kind

543
00:36:41.159 --> 00:36:45.239
of let's clear your thinking a little bit, I think

544
00:36:45.480 --> 00:36:50.239
is what you need to do sometimes. Yeah. Yeah, h wow.

545
00:36:51.400 --> 00:36:56.840
So what's the most powerful piece of advice you find

546
00:36:56.880 --> 00:37:01.199
yourself giving leaders again and again over and over. What's

547
00:37:01.320 --> 00:37:04.719
what's that piece of advice? I think you know it?

548
00:37:06.039 --> 00:37:08.159
Okay, can I be pithy about it. I'm going to

549
00:37:08.239 --> 00:37:11.320
pull up I have the quote here, so there's a

550
00:37:11.400 --> 00:37:15.280
quote by Stephen Covey, and I think it encapsulates a

551
00:37:15.360 --> 00:37:17.519
lot of what we were talking about today and and

552
00:37:17.760 --> 00:37:21.159
the key so dealing with the ambiguity and the uncertainty

553
00:37:21.199 --> 00:37:25.239
and the complexity and the just the stress that everyone

554
00:37:25.400 --> 00:37:28.559
is dealing with. The key is not to prioritize what's

555
00:37:28.599 --> 00:37:32.280
on your schedule, but to schedule your priorities. So it

556
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:36.920
really comes back to this idea of staying connected to

557
00:37:37.039 --> 00:37:40.719
what's important and making sure you're prioritizing time for that.

558
00:37:41.440 --> 00:37:49.039
Okay, yeah, absolutely, that's good. That's good. So tell us

559
00:37:49.199 --> 00:37:53.320
what's uh, what's on the horizon, any any training, any

560
00:37:53.440 --> 00:37:59.199
new books, any uh products, projects coming up that you

561
00:37:59.320 --> 00:38:00.360
want us to know about.

562
00:38:00.840 --> 00:38:05.320
Well, I have a new podcast that I birthed and

563
00:38:06.480 --> 00:38:08.320
you had mentioned it at the beginning. It's called Life

564
00:38:08.360 --> 00:38:11.239
from Within and it's still early days with the podcast,

565
00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:18.119
but it's really about unearthing the wisdom and insight that

566
00:38:18.280 --> 00:38:23.679
we gain through our career challenges. So that is recovering

567
00:38:23.719 --> 00:38:26.960
from a career setback or making a pivot or up

568
00:38:27.119 --> 00:38:29.960
leveling in our careers. Maybe it's launching a new enterprise

569
00:38:30.159 --> 00:38:34.519
or stepping into the executive suite. So I talk with

570
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:38.800
leaders and professionals about their personal growth and about the

571
00:38:38.920 --> 00:38:41.559
wisdom that they've gained as a result of career challenges.

572
00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:46.840
We have four episodes live that are up wherever you

573
00:38:46.920 --> 00:38:49.880
find podcasts. It's called Life from Within. So I would

574
00:38:50.119 --> 00:38:53.719
love it if your listeners would go, take again, take

575
00:38:53.760 --> 00:38:55.880
a listen, take a watch. It's also on YouTube if

576
00:38:55.880 --> 00:38:57.119
you want to prefer to watch it.

577
00:38:57.360 --> 00:38:59.440
So, okay, just put your name in the search box

578
00:38:59.480 --> 00:39:02.000
and it should be able to It'll come right up right.

579
00:39:02.119 --> 00:39:06.400
Yeah, yeah, probably Life from Within and then maybe put

580
00:39:06.519 --> 00:39:09.559
with Kelly Dwyer and then you'll absolutely one hundred percent

581
00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:09.920
get it.

582
00:39:10.480 --> 00:39:14.960
Gotcha? Gotcha? So, Kelly, if someone wanted to reach out

583
00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:18.239
to you, maybe ask you a question about the messy middle,

584
00:39:19.320 --> 00:39:21.039
how could they find you?

585
00:39:22.199 --> 00:39:25.559
I'm so glad you asked. You can go. They can

586
00:39:25.639 --> 00:39:28.960
go to my website Kelly Dwyer dot co so k

587
00:39:29.159 --> 00:39:32.280
E l l Y d w y e R dot

588
00:39:32.480 --> 00:39:36.679
co and there is a contact form on that website.

589
00:39:37.800 --> 00:39:41.719
You can sign up for my newsletter as well, and

590
00:39:42.320 --> 00:39:44.880
I'd be happy to answer any questions that people have

591
00:39:45.199 --> 00:39:49.760
and hop on a call. I'm also on LinkedIn. Kelly Dwyer.

592
00:39:50.039 --> 00:39:53.000
Is I think the handle my LinkedIn handle u r

593
00:39:53.119 --> 00:39:53.880
L it is.

594
00:39:54.480 --> 00:39:56.079
Yeah, I remember that, that's ow.

595
00:39:57.519 --> 00:39:58.599
I'm glad you remember.

596
00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:03.719
Make sure everybody knows it's KD at Kelly Dwyer dot

597
00:40:03.880 --> 00:40:06.400
Coco dot com, not com.

598
00:40:06.599 --> 00:40:09.719
That's right. Yes, so that's my email address. Yeah, and

599
00:40:09.800 --> 00:40:12.079
so people can email me directly if they want exactly.

600
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:16.400
So, just wanted to let everybody know our guest today

601
00:40:16.639 --> 00:40:19.400
is Kelly Dwyer. Want to thank you again for being

602
00:40:19.519 --> 00:40:23.559
on the show. It has been a pleasure. We had

603
00:40:23.599 --> 00:40:26.079
that little technical glitch, but you still gave us some

604
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:30.360
great nuggets and we do appreciate you for coming and

605
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:33.000
sharing your time with us. Thank you so much.

606
00:40:33.519 --> 00:40:37.039
Thank you, doctor Lewis. I really appreciate your generous spirit.

607
00:40:37.199 --> 00:40:37.639
So thank you.

608
00:40:37.719 --> 00:40:42.239
Thank you. Okay, so just to let everybody know what's

609
00:40:42.360 --> 00:40:47.000
going on. I just want to also let you know

610
00:40:47.239 --> 00:40:52.000
I was honored to receive the Prince Georgie's County twenty

611
00:40:52.159 --> 00:40:57.480
twenty five Excellence in Business Business Leader of the Year

612
00:40:57.599 --> 00:41:00.840
Award and guess what it was on my birthday. So

613
00:41:01.400 --> 00:41:03.960
normally for my birthday I go away, but this year

614
00:41:04.119 --> 00:41:08.519
I did not because I stayed to receive the award,

615
00:41:08.679 --> 00:41:13.320
which was double special for me and an honor to

616
00:41:13.440 --> 00:41:16.960
be able to be recognized by my community. So that

617
00:41:17.320 --> 00:41:20.800
was a great birthday gift to me. I'm also thrilled

618
00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:25.320
to share that I've been named one of the International

619
00:41:25.920 --> 00:41:30.480
Power Up Summit Award finalists in the Living Legend Top

620
00:41:30.599 --> 00:41:36.440
Women Over fifty category. This global recognition truly humbles me

621
00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:41.000
a reminder. It's a reminder that purpose, perseverance, and passion

622
00:41:41.199 --> 00:41:44.480
only grows stronger with time. And the Power Up Summit,

623
00:41:44.559 --> 00:41:48.400
hosted by Current Sherry, is taking place at the reticin

624
00:41:48.519 --> 00:41:54.880
Red Heat Throw in London from October sixteenth through the eighteenth,

625
00:41:55.079 --> 00:42:04.199
so the award will be presented during that Actually this week, yeah,

626
00:42:04.440 --> 00:42:08.440
this week it's going to be presented. And don't forget

627
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:11.880
the successful radio show made the list of the top

628
00:42:11.960 --> 00:42:17.119
one hundred best Career, Mindset and Working Women podcasts, and

629
00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:20.639
that we are probably sitting at number sixteen on the list,

630
00:42:20.840 --> 00:42:23.639
which is I think not bad if I have to

631
00:42:23.719 --> 00:42:28.239
say so myself. This list highlights podcasts that empower women

632
00:42:28.760 --> 00:42:33.840
to build successful careers, navigate workplace challenges, and find truth

633
00:42:33.920 --> 00:42:37.599
fulfillment in work and life, and I'm honored, of course

634
00:42:37.679 --> 00:42:41.480
to be among them. Also don't forget my new books

635
00:42:41.519 --> 00:42:45.480
Show Up to Rise Up Explore the Transformative Power of

636
00:42:45.599 --> 00:42:50.599
a Positive Mindset, which achieved bestseller status on Amazon in

637
00:42:50.760 --> 00:42:54.400
Women and Business, and it's now available for purchase. So

638
00:42:54.639 --> 00:42:58.039
if you're ready to embrace change and start living your

639
00:42:58.159 --> 00:43:01.519
best life, now's the time and this book will show

640
00:43:01.559 --> 00:43:04.760
you the way. And it's available now on Amazon. To

641
00:43:04.880 --> 00:43:07.159
get your copy, go to Amazon. You can put in

642
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:10.519
my name in the search box doctor Madlin and Lewis

643
00:43:11.039 --> 00:43:14.960
and the book will come up along with other of

644
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:15.599
my books.

645
00:43:16.320 --> 00:43:17.360
And again.

646
00:43:19.440 --> 00:43:21.639
I also want you to remember that I am a

647
00:43:21.800 --> 00:43:27.400
contributing writer to the onw It magazine and I will

648
00:43:27.440 --> 00:43:32.440
be sharing well. I do share nuggets every month of resources,

649
00:43:33.599 --> 00:43:37.440
different articles on different things with them own It magazine

650
00:43:37.559 --> 00:43:41.800
is a resource for personal, professional, and business development. So

651
00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:45.360
make sure you get a free subscription, and you can

652
00:43:45.440 --> 00:43:48.400
do so. You can contact me if you like about

653
00:43:48.440 --> 00:43:55.440
a free subscription. Email me at Madeline at exwsi dot

654
00:43:55.559 --> 00:43:59.679
com for further details. And don't forget to make sure

655
00:43:59.800 --> 00:44:05.079
that you view my TEDx talk with just on my

656
00:44:05.239 --> 00:44:08.920
teedex talk which is also on YouTube, which I did

657
00:44:09.480 --> 00:44:11.840
of course you know I did it in twenty twenty one,

658
00:44:11.960 --> 00:44:15.079
but I am trying to reach that million mark. The

659
00:44:15.280 --> 00:44:19.519
topic was show up to rise Up. As I said,

660
00:44:19.559 --> 00:44:22.440
you can watch it on YouTube. Just put my name

661
00:44:22.519 --> 00:44:26.000
again in the search box, Doctor Madelann Lewis. It'll come

662
00:44:26.119 --> 00:44:28.840
right up, or you can email me at info at

663
00:44:29.039 --> 00:44:35.559
EXWSI dot com. Check it out, make sure when you

664
00:44:35.719 --> 00:44:38.360
view it that you share it with others. As I said,

665
00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:41.039
the goal is to reach a million plus views, so

666
00:44:41.159 --> 00:44:42.920
I want to thank all of you in advance that

667
00:44:43.119 --> 00:44:49.000
have always already supported the video and has been continuing

668
00:44:49.079 --> 00:44:53.400
to share, like and comment on the video. We're over

669
00:44:54.239 --> 00:44:59.199
two hundred thousands views right now, so we're still growing

670
00:44:59.519 --> 00:45:03.519
and still want to hit that million plus views again.

671
00:45:03.719 --> 00:45:06.800
This is the success for women's show. I would like

672
00:45:06.920 --> 00:45:10.559
to thank my guests Ms. Kelly Dwyer, my viewers, and

673
00:45:10.639 --> 00:45:14.039
my listeners for joining me today. This is a successful

674
00:45:14.119 --> 00:45:17.320
women's show. I'm doctor madlin Ann Lewis, and if you'd

675
00:45:17.400 --> 00:45:19.199
like to reach out to me, you can go to

676
00:45:19.480 --> 00:45:24.559
info at EXWSI dot com or go to my website

677
00:45:24.800 --> 00:45:30.880
www dot EXWSI dot com and you can download my

678
00:45:31.039 --> 00:45:35.039
free three part video series on three things every woman

679
00:45:35.480 --> 00:45:41.119
should do to position herself for executive leadership. Make sure

680
00:45:41.519 --> 00:45:46.239
that don't forget to subscribe to our channel both the

681
00:45:47.159 --> 00:45:52.320
YouTube channel talk for TV channel. Subscribe, share and make

682
00:45:52.400 --> 00:45:54.880
sure you comment let us know what you think about

683
00:45:54.920 --> 00:45:58.280
the show. Again, this is the success for women's show.

684
00:45:58.400 --> 00:46:02.199
We are here every week. I am your host, Doctor

685
00:46:02.239 --> 00:46:06.960
Madeline and Lewis helping women to accelerate the path to success.

686
00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:10.719
Thank you again to my guest Kelly Dwyer for joining me,

687
00:46:10.960 --> 00:46:12.960
my viewers and my listeners.

688
00:46:13.519 --> 00:46:17.480
I love you all to life and as always.

689
00:46:18.079 --> 00:46:20.480
Be well and stay safe out there.

690
00:46:21.400 --> 00:46:22.599
This is success.

691
00:46:23.679 --> 00:46:28.519
Successful Women heard Sunset da.

692
00:46:30.280 --> 00:46:31.159
Coomen.

693
00:46:42.639 --> 00:46:50.840
I'm sy successful Women